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标题: ARM被秒飞?IvB-Y在7瓦模式下仍能Turbo 2.6Ghz [打印本页]

作者: the_god_of_pig    时间: 2013-1-10 13:52
标题: ARM被秒飞?IvB-Y在7瓦模式下仍能Turbo 2.6Ghz
本帖最后由 the_god_of_pig 于 2013-1-10 13:57 编辑


IvB-Y应该是和三棒5250一样在高载时控制频率使功耗维持在7w(5250为4w),SDP模式下和其他ULV的LPM一样默频降为800Mhz,此时仍可以Turbo到最高频率(2.xGhz),只不过维持时间比13w模式短,而只要在平板模式下可以保证CPU功耗始终不超过7w

至于性能,ARM全系被秒飞


http://www.theverge.com/2013/1/9/3856050/intel-candid-explains-misleading-7w-ivy-bridge-marketing





Yesterday, we discovered that Intel had exaggerated about how powerful and efficient its latest low-voltage processors could be — going so far as to invent a new metric, "Scenario Design Point," to explain the discrepancy away. Well, we just spoke to Intel's Dave Salvatore and Edrick Wong in detail about what SDP really means, and why the company chose to shake up the spec sheet.

TDP IS ALL ABOUT HOW MUCH COOLING YOU NEED

First, a brief refresher: Before now, the lowest voltage Intel laptop processors had a 17-watt TDP, and could go down to 13W if a laptop or tablet manufacturer needed. TDP doesn't directly refer to the amount of power they draw, but rather how much cooling they require to dissipate heat. At an Intel event in September, the company promised that we'd see 10W Ivy Bridge chips, and the world mistakenly believed that Intel was still referring to TDP. At the time, there was no other common metric. This week at CES 2013, Intel's PC boss Kirk Skaugen took the stage to tell us that Intel had surpassed its goals — the new Y-series Ivy Bridge chips would run at just 7 watts. But it turned out Intel wasn't referring to TDP anymore. Instead, that 7-watt figure referred to a new "Scenario Design Point" (SDP) measurement. The so-called 7W parts actually have a TDP of 13 watts, with only one chip actually reaching the original 10W TDP goal.

Surprisingly, that doesn't mean that we won't have thinner laptops, tablets, and convertibles, though. Intel can actually limit these processors to 7 watts permanently, so that manufacturers can build thinner designs to suit.

So what happens when these chips run at 7 watts? They're slower, of course.

Today, Intel confirmed to us that though chips like the new Core i7-3689Y run at their advertised 1.5GHz in a system with 13 watts worth of cooling, and turbo up to 2.6GHz when things stay cool enough to do so, they're much slower at stock clocks. At 7 watts, Intel told us, the Core i7-3689Y runs at only 800MHzby default. Here's a crucial note, though: Intel tells us that the processor can still turbo up to that same 2.6GHz when the cooling system has available headroom.

INTEL "1.5GHZ" PROCESSORS RUN AT 800MHZ BY DEFAULT

Moving the power / performance ratio up and down depending on the load isn't anything new. It happens all the time even in existing Ivy Bridge chips. When you're not using a processor's full potential, it runs slower, by switching to a lower clockspeed: 800MHz actually happens to be a fairly common base frequency for low-voltage laptops today. "To save power at home, you want to turn off as many lights in as many rooms as you can… if you're not in the room, turn your lights off!" Intel's Dave Salvatore quips.

It's merely important that you can quickly make that processor faster again, and keep it fast enough to handle demanding tasks for extended periods. What happens at 7 watts, Intel explains, is that the CPU can't turbo up to a high speed as often, or for as long, before the system heats up beyond the computer's ability to cool it down. It could be harder for a laptop or tablet designed for a 7-watt processor to play long, demanding game sessions, render unoptimized video, or other things that typically heat a device up.

So what is SDP?


"As we looked at new form factors, particularly new ones that are really tablet-like, it became clear to us that TDP wouldn't be the right metric to describe the power metrics for those devices," Salvatore explains. Intel believes that with these new touchscreen designs, thinness and battery capacity can trump the ability to harness raw power for extended periods of time. Intel wants to offer manufacturers the flexibility to only have 7W worth of cooling in a tablet to make room for thinner frames and lesser weight, or bigger batteries, and thus the 7W SDP spec. Intel's selling a chip that it belie As laptop reviewers, we actually have to agree: we've reached a point where those things can be the difference between usable and unusable touchscreen machines.

What we still don't agree with is the misleading marketing. The base frequency of a processor doesn't mean as much as it used to, but that doesn't mean it's okay for Intel to say an 800MHz chip runs at 1.5GHz by default. That doesn't mean it's okay to allow manufacturers the opportunity to use that 7W figure to suggest their devices have longer battery life than they actually do.... even though Intel tells us it actually has reduced the idle power by 200 milliwatts across the board compared to existing chips.

IN THE END, IT'S STILL MISLEADING MARKETING

And the intriguing thing is, all of this SDP confusion seems to have been totally unnecessary. Intel's previous Ivy Bridge processors were already able to push their TDP up or down depending on how much cooling a manufacturer included in a device, down to 13W when necessary. (Intel says the new Y-series can't push TDP up.) If Intel and its partners have the ability to make 7W a hard limit for thin touchscreen machines, why not just market and sell 7W TDP and 13W TDP chips separately rather than 13W TDP chips that are also technically capable of the lower wattage and frequency? Intel's done exactly that for years, and even today it sells 45W, 35W and 17W parts for different types of laptop. Intel told us that it's about "intellectual honesty," and allowing its partners the flexibility to use the chips in multiple ways. For instance, large shipment of 7-13W chips (just like existing 13-17W parts) could be repurposed for different types of designs long after a manufacturer plunked down the cash.

Honesty is a tricky thing. What's honest for Intel's partners isn't necessarily honest to computer shoppers like you and me. The upshot is that we'll probably have thinner, lighter, longer-lasting laptops soon, but we need a new metric — and it's not SDP.





作者: Tempestglen    时间: 2013-1-10 14:02
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作者: 明镜止水    时间: 2013-1-10 14:02
期待实际产品
作者: the_god_of_pig    时间: 2013-1-10 14:06
Tempestglen 发表于 2013-1-10 14:02
猪神,你炒菜的时候可以迅速把手指放在锅边又拿开,但是你不敢持续放1-2秒。热能工程,俺的必修课。

玩时 ...

"但这没用,跑个kraken你就露馅了"
别秀下限,ivb-Y能跑几Ghz只不过是决定了ARM是被秒飞还是被秒成灰的区别而已

作者: Tempestglen    时间: 2013-1-10 14:11
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作者: the_god_of_pig    时间: 2013-1-10 14:15
Tempestglen 发表于 2013-1-10 14:11
你2.6Ghz ivy在跑kraken的前三秒确实秒飞了A15,不过整个漫长的kraken跑下来,ivb的平均频率是0.8ghz,才 ...

不是早就算过吗?4核A15只能有800Mhz ivb的性能?

另外谁告诉你800Mhz是平均频率的?CPU1.5Ghz下+GPU满载的cTDP-down配置是10w,7w就得跑800Mhz?笑死人了,所有的i 移动U为了空载省电 LPM下的频率都是800Mhz你不知道?


作者: 54230859    时间: 2013-1-10 14:18
T棍 女人都没有摸过 就说女人皮肤比他细 也只有开始的20年。。。
作者: frankincense    时间: 2013-1-10 14:41
据小道消息说,Surface Pro不带风扇。
这恐怕也是微软一直没有列明Surface Pro的Core i5具体型号的缘故。
作者: the_god_of_pig    时间: 2013-1-10 14:46
frankincense 发表于 2013-1-10 14:41
据小道消息说,Surface Pro不带风扇。
这恐怕也是微软一直没有列明Surface Pro的Core i5具体型号的缘故。

Surface Pro上ivb-Y应该是没什么戏了,之前消息M$公开苏菲的时候I社领导们都很吃惊,就这么几个月换U是来不及了

而且看Pro的厚度很烂,Acer的ivb-Y平板都10mm了

作者: cryman    时间: 2013-1-10 19:27
看情况还是要等苏菲的下一代了
作者: itany    时间: 2013-1-10 19:37
Tempestglen 发表于 2013-1-10 14:11
你2.6Ghz ivy在跑kraken的前三秒确实秒飞了A15,不过整个漫长的kraken跑下来,ivb的平均频率是0.8ghz,才 ...

呵呵,你不要忘了单核能Turbo到多少
作者: slice    时间: 2013-1-10 21:25
本帖最后由 slice 于 2013-1-10 21:28 编辑

5250也是8w呀,强行控制4w的代价是CPU和GPU别想同时满载,所以跑JS是4w这样子。
而Intel的tdp显然是包括GPU和CPU的,显然跑js 7w的sdp就够了,二T神说的某不能利用4线程的JS测试,7w够CPU来turbo了。
13w那是CPU和GPU同时满载的事。


作者: lanyan3232    时间: 2013-1-10 21:28
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作者: Tempestglen    时间: 2013-1-10 22:26
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作者: G70    时间: 2013-1-10 22:30
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作者: Tempestglen    时间: 2013-1-10 22:36
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作者: G70    时间: 2013-1-10 22:37
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作者: Tempestglen    时间: 2013-1-10 22:44
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作者: Tempestglen    时间: 2013-1-10 22:55
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作者: raini    时间: 2013-1-11 00:04
Tempestglen 发表于 2013-1-10 22:55
猪神大概慌不择路了,这篇原文是说intel玩概念游戏,在误导市场,猪神居然引用过来,猪神英文不好的话,我给 ...

你这SB,在骂别人之前,是不是该学习一下基本的逻辑?你的文章和楼主的文章是一篇吗?ARM连个基本的TDP都不敢提供出来,还好意思说别人? 别搞笑了 ,ARM才是被彻底揭穿了!被你奉为标准的an站给出了A15的功耗 ,以及在实际系统中的所谓省电策略!号称是专门为低功耗设计的CPU,竟然要靠限制最高功耗来控制电量损耗。笑死了
作者: the_god_of_pig    时间: 2013-1-11 07:09
Tempestglen 发表于 2013-1-10 22:55
猪神大概慌不择路了,这篇原文是说intel玩概念游戏,在误导市场,猪神居然引用过来,猪神英文不好的话,我给 ...

笑死人了,这不就是1L网站之前跟风犯二时写的文章吗?后来被intel打脸,又被迫写了1L的文章自抽脸,最后还不忘脑补一句"我是对的",这点倒是和你一样
作者: the_god_of_pig    时间: 2013-1-11 07:14
Tempestglen 发表于 2013-1-10 22:26
ipad3跑大型游戏,整机10w功耗,soc大概也是6-7w了,ivb不是吆喝自己7w了吗?很简单,上10寸fanless平板, ...

fanless个头啊,shield已经说明了tegra4全开不能fanless了,上了平板就算fanless了也是靠自宫,有屁用,降频1mhz大家都是fanless。三棒的四核A15也差不多
作者: Tempestglen    时间: 2013-1-11 07:32
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作者: raini    时间: 2013-1-11 08:47
本帖最后由 raini 于 2013-1-11 08:51 编辑
Tempestglen 发表于 2013-1-11 07:32
lz所引用的文章,也在说intel误导,你不懂英文吧。

还有,这篇文章说消费者需要新的散热标准,sdp不 ...


是在说误导吗?人家有这个意思吗?你懂误导是什么意思吗?果然是个SB ,从你以前几个词的用法,以及几个自以为的比喻,就知道你这SB绝不可能是智商正常的货色。劝你一句,别以为别人都是笨蛋,很容易被忽悠!所谓山外有山,人外自然有高人。




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