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标题: 爆大 bug 了，英特尔这次可能要召回 6 系列芯片组了 [打印本页]

作者: Edison 时间: 2011-2-1 01:58
标题: 爆大 bug 了，英特尔这次可能要召回 6 系列芯片组了
http://www.anandtech.com/show/41 ... ipset-begins-recall

from AnandTech Article Channel

In our Sandy Bridge review I pointed out that Intel was unfortunately very conservative in one area of the platform: its chipset. Although the 6-series chipset finally brought native 6Gbps SATA to Intel platforms it failed to fix issues with 23.976 fps video playback. Intel also failed to deliver a chipset that can support SNB's processor graphics as well as overclocking. Today, things just got even more disappointing.

Intel just announced that it has identified a bug in the 6-series chipset, specifically in its SATA controller. Intel states that "In some cases, the Serial-ATA (SATA) ports within the chipsets may degrade over time, potentially impacting the performance or functionality of SATA-linked devices such as hard disk drives and DVD-drives.". I don't know the specifics of the bug yet, but Intel very rarely issues statements like this so it's likely quite serious.

The fix requires new hardware, which means you will have to exchange your motherboard for a new one. Intel hasn't posted any instructions on how the recall will be handled other than to contact Intel via its support page or contact the manufacturer of your hardware directly. In speaking with motherboard manufacturers it seems they are as surprised by this as I am.

Intel will begin shipping the fixed version of the chipset in late February. The recall will reduce Intel's revenue by around $300 million and cost around $700 million to completely repair and replace affected systems.
It Was All Good Just a Week Ago

Here’s the timeline.

Intel has been testing its 6-series chipset for months now. The chipset passed all of its internal qualification tests as well as all of the OEM qualification tests. These are the same tests that all Intel chipsets must go through, testing things like functionality, reliability and behavior at various conditions (high temps, load temps, high voltage, low voltage, etc...). The chipset made it through all of these tests just fine.

There are two general types of problems you run into in chip manufacturing. The first is an engineering oversight: functional problems that will cause a failure during your validation tests. You get these from not giving your engineers enough sleep and they design a circuit that logically or functionally has Pro-Ablem in it. These were the type of errors that resulted in NVIDIA’s Fermi delay for example.

The second type of problem is more annoying, it’s a bug of a statistical nature. In these situations the problem doesn’t appear on every chip in every situation, but on every nth chip out of every n x somereallybignumber chips. When a bug doesn’t present itself in small quantities, it’s very difficult to track down. This is the nature of the 6-series chipset bug and it’s also why the problem didn’t appear sooner.

Intel mentioned that after it had built over 100,000 chipsets it started to get some complaints from its customers about failures. Early last week Intel duplicated and confirmed the failure in house.

Intel put together a team of engineers to discover the source of the problem. Based on the timeline it looks like it took them a couple of days to figure it out. Intel then spent a few more days trying to understand the implications of the issue. Finally, late last night, Intel decided the only course of action would be a recall and it halted production of its 6-series chipsets.

Recalls are never fun to do. If you don’t have a replacement product in the market it means that your sales come to a halt. You also have to deal with actually recalling all of the faulty hardware, which costs a lot of money. Intel expects it’ll cost $700M to actually recall and fix hardware in the market today and another $300M of lost revenue for the chipset business while this is all happening. Altogether we’re talking about a billion dollar penalty. It’s like Intel’s RRoD, but without the years of denial.
The Failure Manifested

I asked Intel how we’d know if we had a failure on our hands. The symptoms are pretty simple to check for. Intel says you’d see an increase in bit error rates on a SATA link over time. Transfers will retry if there is an error but eventually, if the error rate is high enough, you’ll see reduced performance as the controller spends more time retrying than it does sending actual data.

Ultimately you could see a full disconnect - your SATA drive(s) would not longer be visible at POST or you’d see a drive letter disappear in Windows.
It’s Limited to 3Gbps Ports Only

Interestingly enough the problem doesn’t affect ports 1 & 2 on the 6-series chipset. Remember that Intel has two 6Gbps ports and four 3Gbps ports on P67/H67, only the latter four are impacted by this problem.

Intel's DP67BG—The blue SATA ports on the right are 6Gbps, the black ones are 3Gbps. The Blue ports are unaffected by the bug.

If you’re a current Sandy Bridge user and want to be sure you don’t have any problems until you can get replacement hardware, stick to using the 6Gbps ports on your board (which should be the first two ports).
The Fix

The SATA bug exists in hardware and there’s no way to provide a driver or firmware update that can fix it. The fix requires a metal layer change, which will result in a new hardware stepping (resulting in the ~3 week delay before replacement hardware is ready).
What About Current Sandy Bridge Owners?

On its conference call to discuss the issue, Intel told me that it hasn’t been made aware of a single failure seen by end users. Intel expects that over 3 years of use it would see a failure rate of approximately 5 - 15% depending on usage model. Remember this problem isn’t a functional issue but rather one of those nasty statistical issues, so by nature it should take time to show up in large numbers (at the same time there should still be some very isolated incidents of failure early on).

Intel has already halted production of its 6-series chipsets and will begin shipping fixed versions of the chipset in late February. You can expect motherboard shortages through March at least. Intel hopes to be able to meet demand by April.

Currently Intel says the best course of action is to contact its support team for information on replacement, although I’m guessing once the fixed chipsets are available we’ll have replacement plans from all of the motherboard manufacturers.
No One is Happy About This

Given the timeline of discovery, Intel didn’t get around to actually letting its partners know about the problem. On the bright side that means Intel and its partners weren’t plotting against its end users to sweep this under the rug. On the down side, OEMs and motherboard manufacturers can’t be happy about this - they woke up to news of the recall at the same time you and I did.

Intel is starting to have discussions with OEMs today (yep, you read that right) on how to handle the recall and when fixed hardware will be available. This is the reason why there’s currently no official, public recall plan in place. In the coming weeks I expect this to get ironed out but for now the best advice I can give existing SNB owners is to use their 6Gbps ports and wait.
Z68 Schedule Unaffected

I asked Intel if 6-series derivative chipsets were affected by the problem, specifically the Z68 chipset. While all 6-series chipsets are exposed to the issue, the launch schedule for all future derivates remains unaffected. Z68 will continue to launch somewhere in Q2 2011. I would expect to see motherboards around April.

At CES I spoke with Intel at length about the frustrating nature of the P67/H67 feature segmentation. The fact that there's no chipset that will let you use Intel's processor graphics and overclock your CPU is a major oversight. Intel's Z68 chipset will address this shortcoming, as well as add additional features (e.g. SSD caching) that are exclusive to Z68. I am disappointed that Intel wasn't better prepared on the chipset side at the SNB launch and today's announcement is icing on the cake. If you're going to have to wait to buy anyway I would recommend waiting until Z68 motherboards hit the market.

For existing owners, I would hope that Intel and the motherboard manufacturers might offer some sort of a trade-up or trade-in program to move to Z68 since you're going to have to replace your motherboard anyway.
Wait Longer for those MacBook Pros

Have you noticed a lack of dual-core Sandy Bridge based notebooks on the market? Intel wanted to but couldn’t launch every last SNB SKU at the same time, so the dual-core notebooks got pushed out until mid-to-late February. Unfortunately, that was pre-bug. With this latest delay you shouldn’t expect dual-core SNB notebooks until a few weeks after their original launch date, at the earliest.

If we assume fixed chipsets are available in the last week of February, they can be put into systems the first week of March. Then expect at least a week of testing and validation if not more. Add another week to ramp up production and we’re looking at late March or early April for dual-core SNB notebooks. Those of you waiting on Apple’s updated MacBook Pros fall into this category. I’d say April is a safe bet if you’re waiting on an upgrade.

作者: kmzjb2001 时间: 2011-2-1 02:35
刚看到，损失好多USD

作者: xeretsim 时间: 2011-2-1 04:29
意思是6Gbps的端口没事？

作者: tianyuanhan2628 时间: 2011-2-1 05:37
看不懂，请帮忙翻译下。

作者: privater 时间: 2011-2-1 07:11
本帖最后由 privater 于 2011-2-1 09:08 编辑

大意：
1.目前受影响的只是那四个SATA2接口，建议已经购买的用户使用那两个SATA3-6G接口
2.问题表现是：首先错误率越来越高，速度越来越慢，然后就是系统里面硬盘盘符消失

intel官方稿：
http://newsroom.intel.com/commun ... plementing-solution

大意：
1.intel承认最新的6系芯片组存在sata接口随着时间推移会性能降低，由于是设计问题，所以只能更换芯片修复。问题只涉及6系芯片组，沙桥cpu无关
2.目前已经全面停止6系芯片供货，新版本芯片预期在2月底开始供货，全面恢复供货要到4月份。
3.消费者可以联系厂商要求更换，intel会和厂商协商好后续处理。
4.intel预期会损失7亿刀，用来修理和更换这些出问题的芯片。
目前看见美蛋上面的P67 主板几乎全部下架，事情应该闹大了

作者: 结果 时间: 2011-2-1 08:02
本帖最后由结果于 2011-2-1 12:42 编辑

敢于负责
相当于再买一个麦咖啡（这位点评兄：版主在5楼先说70亿，后改为7亿——估计此版主在统计局高就

）

作者: popmars 时间: 2011-2-1 08:34
还好没急着升级。。。。。

作者: hammer999 时间: 2011-2-1 08:37
P67用户表示压力不大，现在开始可以使劲折腾了，等3月份免费换块新的主板。

作者: aliguagua 时间: 2011-2-1 09:04

hammer999 发表于 2011-2-1 08:37
+ E$ T. P* G; I1 xP67用户表示压力不大，现在开始可以使劲折腾了，等3月份免费换块新的主板。

主板怎么折腾也不容易坏吧

作者: lt0115029 时间: 2011-2-1 09:07
此问题解决办法暂不适用于中国大陆地区.

作者: hammer999 时间: 2011-2-1 09:12
回复 aliguagua 的帖子

如果intel确定因为BUG召回的话，坏不坏都可以换一块新版本的了。

作者: hammer999 时间: 2011-2-1 09:13
回复 lt0115029 的帖子

这句话好像文章没看到，intel不会也和丰田一样吧。

作者: Jessey 时间: 2011-2-1 09:20
幸好没升级哈~~~
这下安心等了……

作者: netsnake 时间: 2011-2-1 09:36

我3个硬盘，p67只有2个SATA3接口，我系统盘的硬盘还是接SATA2的。。orz，要赶快换掉。。

作者: nom8393 时间: 2011-2-1 09:42
6系主板开场不顺啊。

作者: 516614863 时间: 2011-2-1 09:44
估计国内的板子没几个厂家会召回的

作者: aliguagua 时间: 2011-2-1 09:46

516614863 发表于 2011-2-1 09:44 % ?, U' z3 { c! @$ ?! P# f* u
估计国内的板子没几个厂家会召回的

有冤大头intel买单，应该不会这样的

作者: 星星 时间: 2011-2-1 09:48
晕啊，昨天叫人从香港带一颗2600K过来，打算春节后再买板子，看来又要延迟了，天天瞪着U看了。

作者: nom8393 时间: 2011-2-1 09:50

516614863 发表于 2011-2-1 09:44 5 o1 P, q& f% f, I+ Q
估计国内的板子没几个厂家会召回的

你是没经历过当年的Intel 810主板召回事件吧？

作者: winfast007 时间: 2011-2-1 10:03
这次intel亏大了。。。。流年不利

作者: atain23 时间: 2011-2-1 10:04
哈哈，太好了。这些尾货要被清理了。OYE～猜猜会掉到多少价。

作者: jista 时间: 2011-2-1 10:25
intel亏大了。。。。

作者: lysine1 时间: 2011-2-1 10:32

草邪恶intel这下要吃鳖了

作者: MAGjt 时间: 2011-2-1 10:46
看来尝鲜是需要付出代价的，还是升级P55来的实在些。

作者: ngsms 时间: 2011-2-1 10:48
这可是爆炸性新闻阿

作者: cadence 时间: 2011-2-1 10:49
才7，8亿美金而已，间接影响销售到是个问题**利才下去4个点。
不过看官方搞，这是个比较初级的设计错误，design没想明白就做改动，发生在小公司很正常，发生在intel就不可思议了。rev A没问题，rev B到出鬼了……

作者: HDD 时间: 2011-2-1 10:54
回复 cadence 的帖子

这就是问题所在，阴谋论四起，$1 billion好大的手笔。不让人过年啊，主板厂傻眼了。

作者: 飞鸟真 时间: 2011-2-1 10:54
k，老子等新机都等2年了，Intel又来这手。
到时候怎么分辨自己的主板是新出的还是返修的呀？

作者: Edison 时间: 2011-2-1 11:08
Intel 的做法还是比较负责的，如果是 AMD ，没准就是像 K10 那样发个 TLB-FIX bios 给厂商蒙混过关了。

作者: lysine1 时间: 2011-2-1 11:15
tlb和这个不能比吧，一个有几率出问题屏蔽一个绕过即可，一个必然慢性死只能换芯片。

作者: hammer999 时间: 2011-2-1 11:48
哈哈。我看国外网站P67都下架了，估计已经卖了的，免费换新是跑不了了，希望intel召回的时候，还能附赠个啥内存啥的以表歉意。不过比较担忧的是，这些下架的有问题的板子，如果不销毁，估计到年底，就会有JS当库存板子出来卖了。以后买2手P67，得注意了，非行货不能买了。

作者: hammer999 时间: 2011-2-1 11:50
回复飞鸟真的帖子

intel肯定不会给返修的，直接换全新主板。不过以后买二手就要小心了，非行货不能碰了，工包弄不好就是芯片有问题的了。

作者: icacfbi 时间: 2011-2-1 11:56
暂缓买P67了什么怪事都有出这事厂家第一批新板子肯定涨价

作者: JFK 时间: 2011-2-1 12:10
整天换接口，这下诏报应了吧

作者: passwordzx 时间: 2011-2-1 12:12

JFK 发表于 2011-2-1 12:10
/ Q7 @: Q1 Y* W/ n/ m% Q整天换接口，这下诏报应了吧

作者: cadence 时间: 2011-2-1 12:20
回复 JFK 的帖子

有道理
不过**出在羊身上……

作者: openlock 时间: 2011-2-1 12:21

星星发表于 2011-2-1 09:48 L# F6 |. Y( y
晕啊，昨天叫人从香港带一颗2600K过来，打算春节后再买板子，看来又要延迟了，天天瞪着U看了。

结果看着看着变成I7 990X

作者: 鱼儿水中游 时间: 2011-2-1 12:41
不可能全召回的，在中国史上有这种事情？

作者: 联力米饭 时间: 2011-2-1 12:45
当年的VC820 只有INTEL和ASUS给了内存其他牌子我记得是没有给内存

作者: yanagisawa 时间: 2011-2-1 13:00
会不会导致P55和H55等降价缓慢

作者: 肥角色 时间: 2011-2-1 13:29
P67有4個SATA III 口的主板，降價促銷的話，還是不錯的，不用SATA II 就是啦，怕么，有USB3.0兼容USB2.0，是我的話，過年后見到4個SATA III 的P67主板大降價，肯定秒了。

作者: xlongx 时间: 2011-2-1 13:44
i社活该倒霉，自作孽不可活

作者: xlongx 时间: 2011-2-1 13:45
成天只知道换接口，换散热孔位，自己找死了吧
AMD也是个残疾，几年了还在K8那里修修补补

作者: nom8393 时间: 2011-2-1 14:35

肥角色发表于 2011-2-1 13:29
! O& f" n3 A& l$ EP67有4個SATA III 口的主板，降價促銷的話，還是不錯的，不用SATA II 就是啦，怕么，有USB3.0兼容USB2.0，是 ...

SATA2接口击穿之后，不知道会不会对整个芯片有影响；所以对这批产品降价促销是极不负责的行为，Intel是不会干的。

作者: amd```fans 时间: 2011-2-1 14:47

联力米饭发表于 2011-2-1 12:45
' z) j# A' b8 v当年的VC820 只有INTEL和ASUS给了内存其他牌子我记得是没有给内存

同时换内存和主板是为了保证同级别性能，且因为sdram无法兼容820。这次p67/h67只需换板

作者: kunnsr 时间: 2011-2-1 15:08
工包P67 H67 快点来只用2个SATA 6G 也行只要够便宜

作者: 联力米饭 时间: 2011-2-1 15:31
3年内坏的可能性 5% 我试问一下这个论坛有多少还在用3年前的主板

作者: zpcz 时间: 2011-2-1 15:58
本帖最后由 zpcz 于 2011-2-1 16:00 编辑

MAGjt 发表于 2011-2-1 10:46
- J- J& {# [- W9 h7 p看来尝鲜是需要付出代价的，还是升级P55来的实在些。

我倒觉得是个捡便宜的机会

作者: luser 时间: 2011-2-1 17:14
回复联力米饭的帖子

780G 正在使用中。

作者: yuanico 时间: 2011-2-1 17:50
和当年p3 1.13ghz的bug比起来其实问题算小的了但是上次是被amd逼的犯了错这次连竞争者都没有结果自己摔跤了只能说缺乏竞争的市场领跑者自己都打瞌睡了

作者: gw000tj 时间: 2011-2-1 17:53
intel的做法还是比较严谨负责的，这点要肯定~

作者: sleuth 时间: 2011-2-1 18:13

gw000tj 发表于 2011-2-1 17:53
0 I$ S: w# k k& ~" g6 V0 \intel的做法还是比较严谨负责的，这点要肯定~

这样的肯定毫无意义。
很多人购机计划会受到影响，已经是既成事实了。

真的严谨负责的话，就不会出这种问题了。
据说，测试样品时没有缺陷的，真是蛮乌龙的。
内部管理肯定出现了混乱。

作者: 516614863 时间: 2011-2-1 20:51

nom8393 发表于 2011-2-1 09:50 + \1 \' a/ S; p4 h
你是没经历过当年的Intel 810主板召回事件吧？

当年的820事件，也只是很小1部分厂家回收了自己的板子，在送内存，大部分的都是装死，还有就是，厂家肯换，经销商那里就把送的内存扣下卖掉

作者: sanna 时间: 2011-2-1 20:59
**solidot.org/it/11/02/01/0449231.shtml

因设计问题Intel召回Sandy Bridge芯片组
blackhat 发表于 2011年2月01日 12时45分星期二 Printer-friendly Email story
来自不要尝鲜部门
Bug Intel
Intel宣布召回搭配Sandy Bridge处理器使用的6系列芯片组，原因是芯片组的SATA控制器存在严重的设计缺陷，会导致性能随时间推移而降级。 Intel决定召回产品，替换有问题的部件。该公司在声明中称，购买了P67和H67 “Cougar Point”芯片组的顾客可继续使用，它指出缺陷只与性能有关，不会导致数据丢失。虽然如此，此类用户最好能联系硬件制造商更换硬件。Intel表示，召回和修正错误将导致它损失7亿美元，该公司已经对其业绩预期进行了修改。

作者: felix0524 时间: 2011-2-2 00:42
他妹子的，我在淘宝上找的香港代购啊，不知道能换不，郁闷死

作者: nom8393 时间: 2011-2-2 08:25

sleuth 发表于 2011-2-1 18:13 ' e; E Y/ r S5 E( v
这样的肯定毫无意义。
, D; p. P$ W3 y8 S+ y很多人购机计划会受到影响，已经是既成事实了。

Intel是经别人提醒才发现bug的，测试根本没注意这个问题；所以说intel的QC体系这次出了大麻烦，不知道还有没有其他bug。

作者: 飞鸟真 时间: 2011-2-2 11:15
刚才看【请勿打广告】网新闻，说4月份才开始改版芯片全面供货。
不知推土机5月能不能出来，估计够呛，如果5月出来我第一次换amd平台了。

作者: nom8393 时间: 2011-2-2 11:44

飞鸟真发表于 2011-2-2 11:15 ~ {+ V+ d5 b
刚才看【请勿打广告】网新闻，说4月份才开始改版芯片全面供货。, g, \! I. E) e5 Z0 i
不知推土机5月能不能出来，估计够呛，如果 ...

AMD废物，这么百年一遇的好时机都抓不住，买块豆腐撞死算了。

作者: 飞鸟真 时间: 2011-2-2 11:47

nom8393 发表于 2011-2-2 11:44 6 V+ b5 q+ t l! a$ U# c+ v
AMD废物，这么百年一遇的好时机都抓不住，买块豆腐撞死算了。

amd早就没斗志了，虽生犹死，唉

作者: victor_5891 时间: 2011-2-2 11:50
P67用户可以免费升级主板了，我觉得是福音！

作者: xiaofeng_000 时间: 2011-2-2 11:58
不是第一次了吧 820 915 ich-6

作者: xiaofeng_000 时间: 2011-2-2 12:07
还要算上slot 1 1.13G的PIII 和自动降频的 3.6G? P4
奇怪之前那些乌龙事件都是因为各方面的压力。。
这次P67可以说毫无市场压力可言。。。
AMD落后好几条街。。。
intel还犯这样的错误。。。

作者: amd```fans 时间: 2011-2-2 13:01

lysine1 发表于 2011-2-1 11:15 : ^! A; p6 Y* g7 M- _
tlb和这个不能比吧，一个有几率出问题屏蔽一个绕过即可，一个必然慢性死只能换芯片。

TLB bug bios屏蔽绕过会导致性能下降。如果这次是a社，估计又是出新bios屏蔽掉有问题的sata接口了事.

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